Laches and Charmides PDF À Laches and PDF/EPUB or

Laches and Charmides Difficult but totally worth the effortAs in the other Platonic dialogues, Socrates continues to ask the definition of a single virtue courage in Laches and temperance sophrosyne in Charmides I won t go over all the details of their elenchus, as it s probably summarized in many cliffnotes already I would like to make some comments regarding the two dialogues.Although Charmides issubtle and muchcomplicated than Laches in its logic and approach, the two dialogues both try to elucid Difficult but totally worth the effortAs in the other Platonic dialogues, Socrates continues to ask the definition of a single virtue courage in Laches and temperance sophrosyne in Charmides I won t go over all the details of their elenchus, as it s probably summarized in many cliffnotes already I would like to make some comments regarding the two dialogues.Although Charmides issubtle and muchcomplicated than Laches in its logic and approach, the two dialogues both try to elucidate what we actually mean by a single virtue First of all, I would like to address a major issue in Plato s theory of virtue, that is if virtue is truly in a single form Could virtue be inthan one form, or OUGHT it have just a single form Are they really just shadows of the true single idea of virtue if they are variegated with different aspects In the end of their discussion, the respondents who first claimed to know what the repective virtues are failed to answer it and reveal their ignorance and thus their lack of these virtues This raises another question Do these virtues truly have to be a knowledge of something Does the ignorance or inability to define these virtues automatically disqualify them as possessors of these virtues Socrates introduces us to the concept of the tinos word that appears to be complete by itself but actually is not The word needs another word to explain itself So, knowledge should be backed up by another word that explains of what the knowledge is eg knowledge of good and evil He also distinguishes the first order art science from the second order art The first order art has a recognizable scope and object, whereas the second order art deals with the first order art as its scope of art Critias regards temperance as the knowledge of the first order art such as medicine and the second order art of good and evil, but comes to the moment of aporia Like many Platonian dialogues, the solution to the problem is inconclusive and instead brings the epiphany of ignorance in order to stimulate his newfound urge to discover the truth.Whether the virtue questioned is courage or temperance, and whether the participants in the dialogue are frustrated with the conclusion, the answer seems to lie in the aporia itself and hints that all these virtues are different aspects of the single form or knowledge of the good and evil This reminded me of all the various branches of knowledge such as history, economics, physics, philosophy, biology, chemistry, psychology, etc Although they each seem to dealing with different objects in such distinct ways, they seem to be diverging pathways to the common goal of truth Our world of scientific research gives grants to research that seem to be done for the sake of research only under the misconception of science as the virtue and not as the neutral means to attain that object Even our most acclaimed political and military policies are jumbled up results of our confusion of the second order art of distinguishing the good and evil with the first order art They make us question the two important virtues, courage and temperance, and we should all ask ourselves the actual aim and the extent of our knowledge.I also noticed how both Laches and Charmides are less articulate or acquainted with Socrates dialectic method than their respective partners, Nicias and Critias However, they both arehonest in admiting their ignorance and areeager to discover the truth This attitude of acknowledging one s ignorance is the gate opening up the real possibilities of discovering the truth and is emphasized in many of the dialogues The false belief in our knowledge is the toughest barrier to attaining a true education and a virtuous life Nothing is worse than a confident know nothing know it all So keep those questions alive and coming 1 Corinthians 3 18Do not deceive yourselves If any of you think you are wise by the standards of this age, you should become fools so that you may become wisechokengtitiktitikchokengs I wish the IRB or any ethical committee reads this when they are contemplating whether any new scientific research is actually good or not I didn t read this exact translation, but I did listen to these two dialogues I didn t really get much out of them I even watched some summaries analyses online I felt like they were too inconclusive to be satisfying I know that one of Socrates s main methods is to question everything until we conclude that we do not truly understand the nature of something This was certainly the case in Alcibiades I But I found Alcibiades I very entertaining and satisfying, whereas Laches and Charmides we I didn t read this exact translation, but I did listen to these two dialogues I didn t really get much out of them I even watched some summaries analyses online I felt like they were too inconclusive to be satisfying I know that one of Socrates s main methods is to question everything until we conclude that we do not truly understand the nature of something This was certainly the case in Alcibiades I But I found Alcibiades I very entertaining and satisfying, whereas Laches and Charmides were less interesting to me I enjoyed Charmides a littleI would say, because it feltvisual than Laches Anyway, I m glad I listened to these So proud of myself for having read another philosophy book I knew it would be a challenge, but one I was ready for.Laches and Charmides are two platonic texts on virtue Laches took me longer to finish, but it includes an introduction to what is virtue, which serves other texts as well Laches deals with courage and how parents can help their children acquire this virtue In the end, results were inconclusive but the process and Socratic method used help you also draw your own conclusions and t So proud of myself for having read another philosophy book I knew it would be a challenge, but one I was ready for.Laches and Charmides are two platonic texts on virtue Laches took me longer to finish, but it includes an introduction to what is virtue, which serves other texts as well Laches deals with courage and how parents can help their children acquire this virtue In the end, results were inconclusive but the process and Socratic method used help you also draw your own conclusions and the method on its own helps you think clearly.Charmides wasfun and the reason why I read Laches too I have to say, it s quite gay with Socrates initial crush on Charmides who is from Plato s family, so he must have been handsome too was cute In Charmides, Socrates, Charmides and Critio discuss what is temperance The arguments were clear although sometimes confusing The hypothetical method was used a lot The ending was also good although no certain conclusion as to what temperance is and if it is the good, were reached Some of the arguments certainly make you think Plato s dialogues are incredibly well written and tend to circle round and round the stated objective of the dialogue without ever quite hitting the bullseye His linkage of knowledge and virtue seems to always play a central theme At time he critiques his characters for having definitions that are too narrow to serve as the definition At others he gets on to them for having definitions that are so vague they barely distinguish one thing from the other Plato is harsher with those who seem too Plato s dialogues are incredibly well written and tend to circle round and round the stated objective of the dialogue without ever quite hitting the bullseye His linkage of knowledge and virtue seems to always play a central theme At time he critiques his characters for having definitions that are too narrow to serve as the definition At others he gets on to them for having definitions that are so vague they barely distinguish one thing from the other Plato is harsher with those who seem too cocksure He blasts rigid dogmatics whenever he encounters it With those who seemflexible he still corrects, but generally not as harshly as with others I still think a lot of his game is to play with language He often lampoons Prodicus for his sophistry in definitions while using language in a way that would make Prodicus proud Of the two, Charmides iscomplex in its philosophy But, I find the characters of Lachescompelling The two Generals,Nicias and Laches are muchof an interesting pair than Critias and Charmides Just as always Plato disappoints most of the time.E I never went through so much to find out nothing was known But at least they set it up for the sequel It would be so frustrating to talk with Socrates Are his arguments logical fallacies or evasive Guess I need to go talk to the philosopher who recommended it to me. The point of the Laches dialogue is not evident It s similar to Protagoras that way There s much discussion about virtue specifically, courage and, in the end, we don t know what it means As with other Plato dialogues, we get hints of the cosmological background from which Plato writes When Socrates takes the bait and objects to decision making by majority, he says that decisions should be based on knowledge by experts In other dialogues, such knowledge is that of the divine world and The point of the Laches dialogue is not evident It s similar to Protagoras that way There s much discussion about virtue specifically, courage and, in the end, we don t know what it means As with other Plato dialogues, we get hints of the cosmological background from which Plato writes When Socrates takes the bait and objects to decision making by majority, he says that decisions should be based on knowledge by experts In other dialogues, such knowledge is that of the divine world and expertise in that area lies with those philosophers aligned with Plato s thought There are also references to souls of young men Again, from other dialogues we might reasonably suspect that Plato s virtue has something to do with the soul s health and the divine world of philosophical wisdom None of this virtue, knowledge, soul is explicit in this dialogue, and it suffers as a result.As with Laches, Charmides is disappointing It starts out with some promise There s an issue about the health of Charmides soul and Socrates engages the other characters in the dialogue with his series of questions about this and that, and the reader, if not the characters themselves, get lost or hopelessly confused Toward the end, we understand that temperance, a sort of self control, is a virtue because it allows one to distinguish real from false knowledge and to be aware of ignorance which may refer to the things of this world that are not real While Socrates is not explicit, it appears that real knowledge involves the sense of good and bad and the science of the soul What good and bad and science and soul are is not discussed, although we might guess from other dialogues that all of these have something to do with the presumed reality of an immortal world Rosamond Kent Sprague s translations of the Laches and Charmides are highly regarded, and relied on, for their lucidity and philosophical acuity This edition includes notes by Sprague and an updated bibliography A must read to those who seldom question anything in life This book becomes frustrating to any reader due to its inability to find a conclusive argument and thus employ a circular question It is a short read, but quite a difficult one to grapple with easily.


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